Should the death penalty be applied to murderers of all ages?

crimson089 - not much work, just a few ctrl c and v, and i just like the color of purple lol, ok sorry i'll make it easier for your eyes only heheh

Thank you.
It is a lot easier, and i do appreciate it. :)

- it doesn't remove the threat, death penalty is not justice and it should not be applied to murderers of all ages

It removes that one killer/rapist from our society.That's what i mean by threat.
I don't think it should be applied to anyone, unless the points i mentioned earlier could be met.(100% certainty of guilt + extremely low chance of rehabilitation)

- what are you talking about, revenge doesn't mean killing. anyone here know of any study like this?

I'm talking about the death penalty as a means of revenge, instead of a means to remove a threat from our society.
Also i'm talking about the use of torture, which i oppose in every case.

- so we're talking about revenge here. ever heard of 'an eye for an eye'? Although many aspects of vengeance resemble the concept of justice, revenge connotes a more injurious and punitive focus as opposed to a harmonious and restorative one. Whereas justice generally implies actions undertaken and supported by a legitimate judicial system, by a system of ethics, or on behalf of an ethical majority, revenge generally implies actions undertaken by an individual or narrowly defined group outside the boundaries of judicial or ethical conduct. The goal of revenge usually consists of forcing the perceived wrongdoer to suffer the same or greater pain than that which was originally inflicted. and for torture, they deserve it. they should have use their heads before doing all those actions. i want to hear your side of which it is childish.

I have stated my side already.
I think revenge is childish.
I think justice is what we should strive for.
I think torture is inhumane, and just because the convict might have done terrible things, if we do the same things to him, we are no better then him.
And yes, i've heard of an eye for an eye, and i don't agree with it.

- everyone? on punishment? are you kidding, everyone seems to focus on taxes!

Well, i'm talking about the people on this thread.I admit i did not read it entirely, but it seemed to me there were more people talking about torture then about taxes.
But if you want to bring that up, capital punishment costs more then life sentence.Link

- heheheh

Lol.

- that Law of God he was talking about was morality, nothing else. he didn't say use it to make Legal decisions.

Really?
So he was saying "Follow morality"?
WTF does that even mean?
No, he said his deity would know what kind of judgment to administer.He was clearly stating we should implement his god's laws into our system.Whatever laws and whatever god that might be.
Morality has nothing to do with god.
Morality is subject to the culture.
At the time the bible was written it was morally accepted to beat your slave, as long as it took him a couple days to die and he didn't die right away.
Today it's immoral to have a slave, even if you never lay a hand on him.

- Well, you seem to like a lot of people.
I feel bad for you.

Yes i do, indeed.
I love my family and friends.
I like people who are nice and try to do good things.

Why not generalize,

Because that's what leads to extremism, like racism, xenophobia, homophobia, etc.
It shows you are not capable of separating people from beliefs or ideals, and it reveals a shallow individual.

Not all cops are good.
Not all atheists think like you, that's true. Not all religious people think the way I do too.

My point exactly.
That's why i don't hate theists.
There are certain aspects of theism that i hate.
But just about everyone i personally know is a theist, including my family ( wife, mother, etc) and i like just about all of them.
Example:
I hate it when theists try to get creationism taught in schools.
However, one of my best friends is a creationist, and i don't hate him at all.
See the difference?

i'm not perfect. i do agree i hate certain groups of people because of their ways, if that's not healthy then i can't just like them or what, i can do nothing about it.

Well, even though you say you hate me, i don't sense that in your posts.
I think you just use the word hate too lightly.
Maybe you hate my conviction that there is no god.Or you hate my belief that religion should be kept out of government.
But i don't think you hate me.
You don't even know me.
So what do you think?
Is it me you hate?Or is it my ideals?

- okay, let's just keep it healthy ;D

Sounds good!

Ya shouldnt kill someone for killing another person that just makes you as bad as the killer.
Plus animals do it all the time for food so thats ok but a cat for instace kill's for fun do you think we should kill cats?

Replying to #122

In the cat case, it would be manslaughter (or ratslaughter), not murder.
The cat does not intentionally kill the rat.He just wants to play with it.Or so i heard...

I go the biblical way.
There was a chapter in the bible that one man killed another, and the killer thought another man would kill him. No other man would end the killer's life, so if someone did, the punishment of sin would be SEVEN TIMES WORSE.THOU SHAIL NOT KILL
and
ONE WRONG DOES NOT MAKE A RIGHT!
Also, "One's Right to ball up a fist ends when that fist collides with anther's face"
I am %100 against people killing others in real life. In video games; sure why the hell not?
That killer will die of Cancer anyway!You can see the demons in everyone's soul when they shout at a killer "YOU DESERVE TO DIE! KILL HIM!"
Stupid Mortals...they will learn one day that their ways are wrong, no getting around it.

Oteupaiecona · #123In the cat case, it would be manslaughter (or ratslaughter), not murder.
The cat does not intentionally kill the rat.He just wants to play with it.Or so i heard...

Lol its not always rats and ya never know why they kill em it might be cause there hungry or maybe cause they wanna play but i'm sure they can kill them on purpose for no particular reson

spire208 · #122Ya shouldnt kill someone for killing another person that just makes you as bad as the killer.
Plus animals do it all the time for food so thats ok but a cat for instace kill's for fun do you think we should kill cats?

A cat does not kill for fun. The only animals that kill for fun are baboons and humans.

Well they hunt for fun and they usally kill there pray and i'm talking about domestic cats even if there full they kill a mouse or bird but wont eat it.
And Baboons really didnt know that

cats do not hunt for fun. they do it because they are predators and it is an instinct.

Oteupaiecona · #121I'm talking about the death penalty as a means of revenge, instead of a means to remove a threat from our society.
Also i'm talking about the use of torture, which i oppose in every case.

- okay you're talking about death penalty as a means of revenge when i'm talking about pain as a means of revenge. take a look at the previous posts.

Oteupaiecona · #121I have stated my side already.
I think revenge is childish.

- no you haven't, you just keep on saying revenge is childish.

Oteupaiecona · #121I think justice is what we should strive for.

- hmm, i really think there is no justice in this world. keep on striving though.

Oteupaiecona · #121I think torture is inhumane, and just because the convict might have done terrible things, if we do the same things to him, we are no better then him.

- well I think murder is inhuman, and torture is a good punishment. we don't need to be better than him, if he killed 3 children you don't really need to do the same thing to him but instead let him feel the pain. btw, it still depends on the case.

Oteupaiecona · #121And yes, i've heard of an eye for an eye, and i don't agree with it.

- revenge again huh. i remember the count of monte cristo, it's really a great novel and also there was this game where it teaches the players 'revenge', where vengeance is always an option, i think it's called rohan blood feud, it's really a good game, i was at lvl32. anyway, i don't see why you won't agree with it.

Oteupaiecona · #121Well, i'm talking about the people on this thread.I admit i did not read it entirely, but it seemed to me there were more people talking about torture then about taxes.
But if you want to bring that up, capital punishment costs more then life sentence.

- oic, you should have specified 'everyone on this thread'. alright i got that.

Oteupaiecona · #121Really?
So he was saying "Follow morality"?
WTF does that even mean?
No, he said his deity would know what kind of judgment to administer.He was clearly stating we should implement his god's laws into our system.Whatever laws and whatever god that might be.
Morality has nothing to do with god.
Morality is subject to the culture.
At the time the bible was written it was morally accepted to beat your slave, as long as it took him a couple days to die and he didn't die right away.
Today it's immoral to have a slave, even if you never lay a hand on him.

- did you just said 'what the f--- does that mean?', okay i don't have to explain this to you because you won't understand it anyway. and btw, stop that preaching cause i'm not interested in your beliefs. i'm not a catholic, muslim, atheist, or buddhist, and i never stated my own beliefs here. if that is what he told you then go, keep on believing that.

Oteupaiecona · #121Yes i do, indeed.
I love my family and friends.
I like people who are nice and try to do good things.

- I hate murderers and racists.
I hate people who are not nice and try to do bad things.

Oteupaiecona · #121My point exactly.
That's why i don't hate theists.
There are certain aspects of theism that i hate.
But just about everyone i personally know is a theist, including my family ( wife, mother, etc) and i like just about all of them.
Example:
I hate it when theists try to get creationism taught in schools.
However, one of my best friends is a creationist, and i don't hate him at all.
See the difference?

- as i was saying, i hate certain group of people because of their actions and way of thinking, not really them. I hate atheists when they're starting to lose respect. I have friends who are atheists and we don't really have problems with each other.

Oteupaiecona · #121Well, even though you say you hate me, i don't sense that in your posts.
I think you just use the word hate too lightly.
Maybe you hate my conviction that there is no god.Or you hate my belief that religion should be kept out of government.
But i don't think you hate me.
You don't even know me.
So what do you think?
Is it me you hate?Or is it my ideals?

- WTH! i didn't said i hate you or anything like that, i love everyone here in romulation, wait you're the one who brought this Like & Hate thing up in the first place, let's cut it out okay!

Oteupaiecona · #121Sounds good!

- just don't get too carried away ;)

Replying to #129

Well, in my original post (the one you then replied too) i was talking about both the death penalty and torture as a means of revenge.
I still don't agree with any of the two.

- no you haven't, you just keep on saying revenge is childish.-

What?
Isn't that what you asked me?
Which i thought was childish?
???

hmm, i really think there is no justice in this world. keep on striving though.-

Give up easily, do you?
Ahaha...
Yeah, the world is a effed up place.
But yeah, i do think we should strive for justice, peace, and all that happy horse shoot.

Replying to #129

You really think the victim would feel better, if he saw the convict getting tortured?
I would agree the death penalty depends on the case.Torture?
Never.

Replying to #129

I don't see how you can think it's ok to torture.

Replying to #129

I did.
I started my post with:" A lot of the posts here seem to be focused on revenge"

Replying to #129

Yeah, i guess i won't.Since morality is subjective, IMO.

Replying to #129

Care to explain in what ways am i preaching?

Replying to #129

He didn't tell me, he posted it on the thread.
I guess this means you're gonna stop defending his post?

Replying to #129

I hate the acts of murdering and raping.
Yeah, i will also hate someone who is shown to do these things out of pure evil.

Replying to #129

Are you saying that certain groups of people will all behave in the same manner and think exactly alike?

Replying to #129

Then you don't hate atheists.You hate it when a certain atheist says/does something that to you means he is losing respect.

Replying to #129

You said you hate atheists.I'm an atheist.1+1=2.

wait you're the one who brought this Like & Hate thing up in the first place, let's cut it out okay!- just don't get too carried away ;)

Actually you were the one who stated your hatred for atheists (as a generalization), i just replied to that.
But you have now clarified that you don't hate all atheists all the time.
That is what i was trying to get at.
And yes, you are right.
This is a dead horse now.Let's stop beating it.

no, I mean, What the heck?! you accidentally pull the trigger on a gun and kill someone?! (Like when as a old as a baby?!)

OteupaieconaWell, in my original post (the one you then replied too) i was talking about both the death penalty and torture as a means of revenge.
I still don't agree with any of the two.What?
Isn't that what you asked me?
Which i thought was childish?
???Give up easily, do you?
Ahaha...
Yeah, the world is a effed up place.
But yeah, i do think we should strive for justice, peace, and all that happy horse shoot.You really think the victim would feel better, if he saw the convict getting tortured?
I would agree the death penalty depends on the case.Torture?
Never.I don't see how you can think it's ok to torture.I did.
I started my post with:" A lot of the posts here seem to be focused on revenge"Yeah, i guess i won't.Since morality is subjective, IMO.Care to explain in what ways am i preaching?
He didn't tell me, he posted it on the thread.
I guess this means you're gonna stop defending his post?I hate the acts of murdering and raping.
Yeah, i will also hate someone who is shown to do these things out of pure evil.Are you saying that certain groups of people will all behave in the same manner and think exactly alike?Then you don't hate atheists.You hate it when a certain atheist says/does something that to you means he is losing respect.You said you hate atheists.I'm an atheist.1+1=2.
Actually you were the one who stated your hatred for atheists (as a generalization), i just replied to that.
But you have now clarified that you don't hate all atheists all the time.
That is what i was trying to get at.
And yes, you are right.
This is a dead horse now.Let's stop beating it.

*yawns*this isn't getting entertaining anymore, some are repetitive. if this will go further i'll be really bored. hmm i'm not really good at debates, alright you win but still i'm for revenge ONLY if necessary and i'm not for death penalty. striving for justice and world peace, lol i thought only kids believe on that nowadays, you're kindhearted. but thank you for your thoughts and opinion, by judging you i think some of your arguments are quite strong. i don't hate atheists okay! actually there is one atheist that i really really love and that's albert wesker lol he's so evil! hold on, is he even an atheist, is there any religion who believes that he is the God? anyway gtg, it's 1am here and my narcolepsy is bugging me. goodnight and see ya!

Replying to #132

Ahaha...Sorry to get you bored.
Yeah, you're right it is getting repetitive.
And i'm not trying to win anything, i was just exchanging opinions with you.

Replying to #132

I guess this is were we differ.
I'm not for revenge and you are.
I'm not for torture and you are.
We both oppose the death penalty.

Replying to #132

I never said world peace. ;)

Replying to #132

Thank you.
I also enjoyed reading your opinion.
But yeah, opinion is what we are debating here.
We won't change each others minds.

Replying to #132

Ok, lol.
Have a goodnight's sleep! 8)

The bottom line is that in order to change things for the better fundamentally, you must begin to address root causes. Our current society's system of "punishment" is outmoded, inhumane, and unproductive. When a serial killer is caught, most people jump up and down and scream for the death of that person. This is backwards.A truly sane society, which understands what we are and how our value systems are created, would take the individual and learn the reasons behind his or her violent actions. This information would then go to a research department which considers how to stop such conditions from occurring through education.It is time to stop the patchwork. It is time to begin a new social approach which is updated to present day knowledge. Sadly, society today is still largely based on outmoded, superstitious dispositions and resolutions.Watch "Zeitgeist Addendum", a documentary made earlier this year which created a movement already in the hundreds of thousands.
www.ZeitgeistMovie.comI copied this text from the movement's main website at
www.theZeitgeistMovement.com

Thank you Magides.
That is basically what i was trying to say.
We should focus more on prevention.
As for Zeitgeist Addendum, i do agree with much of the stuff in it.
But i think the big picture it presents is communism with makeup on.
It's been a while since i've watched though...

i agree that the death penalty is wrong. not so much of the revenge or torture or punishment or eye for an eye, but that i think it gives murderers an easy way out and punishes accidental incidents more than it should. justice would be that murderers get to live with it in jail for life in seclusion and unintentional manslaughter gets therapy. BUT the problem is that people's emotions get the better of them and turn barbaric and want heads to roll so they demand death for their loss but the problem is that what happens to that family's loss. nobody comes back. i think its got more to do with the fact that certain religious groups believe that people who do wrong go to hell and people who are wronged go to heaven so there is a divine justice even though the REAL situation is that two people are now dead, everyone is pissed off at everyone else, and nothing got solved. way to go. Death penalty is wrong.

What if an 8 yr old accidentally shoots his father "there" and was killed, is the child guilty? No, since it's the father's fault letting his son get to hold the gun or letting the gun in reach in the first place, It's in the news. (The child will be guilty if he did it on purpose, or he thought it was a toy, then there are problems that should be decided by the jury.)No, death penalty shouldn't be available in very young minors, nor to the people who are difficulty abled, nor to the people who doesn't deserve to be killed, there should be wisdom for those who uphold the laws, there are many cases and exceptions where death penalty should be applied, since every rule has an exception, and the exceptions also have exceptions, and so forth.

Like Hammurabi said "Eye for an eye, tooth for a thooth.", I think that if you take the life of human being by cause, you should suffer death penalty. Were you young or old.

rather than capital punishment, I would rather see these murderers to get enslaved for life.then we would have tons of free labors and these peoples can start working to death for the community. Capital punishment costs money, and life-prison costs even more, so why not work them to death? I know it's not humane but who cares, these murderers don't even know what humanity is..

There really is a key term here everyone may have missed. Pre meditation. Meaning that if the individual, whether being eight or eighty, in their mind before said act, plotted, and decided to carry the decisive action out. Also some, people have chemical imbalances in their heads, and never get a medical diagnosis of it. This one is a shade of gray issue, and most likely, will never result in anything ever truly being learned, but the continuation of a cycle that has been existent since mankind's creation. Children now are exposed to things I never was, and for that I feel some weakness(not sorrow), but they are becoming adults at five and seven now. So, should they take another's life, and it is found they carried out the action, after heavy forethought(compulsorily behavior, excluded) then yes, the death penalty is applicable.